<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto">Hi Thorsten,<div><br></div><div>If you came up with a pithy example and then integrated in with the Agda docs (specifically <a href="https://agda.readthedocs.io/en/v2.6.1/language/without-k.html">https://agda.readthedocs.io/en/v2.6.1/language/without-k.html</a>), that’s be welcome. By me, at least.<div><br></div><div>Bill<br><br><div dir="ltr">Sent from my iPad</div><div dir="ltr"><br><blockquote type="cite">On Aug 15, 2020, at 10:21 AM, Thorsten Altenkirch <Thorsten.Altenkirch@nottingham.ac.uk> wrote:<br><br></blockquote></div><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">I found <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><a href="https://github.com/agda/agda/issues/2890">https://github.com/agda/agda/issues/2890</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">but this mentions “with” which I wasn’t using. Also increasing termination depth didn’t help in my case.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">I can try to cook up a short example but maybe this is a known issue?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Thorsten<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">From: </span></b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Agda <agda-bounces@lists.chalmers.se> on behalf of Thorsten Altenkirch <Thorsten.Altenkirch@nottingham.ac.uk><br>
<b>Date: </b>Saturday, 15 August 2020 at 15:16<br>
<b>To: </b>Jason -Zhong Sheng- Hu <fdhzs2010@hotmail.com>, "agda@lists.chalmers.se" <agda@lists.chalmers.se><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [Agda] Weird termination problem<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Yes, indeed this worked. And the difference was that in the previous version I hadn’t used no-K.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Thanks a lot – I was truly stumped. And I do remember that there were some issues with termination checking when switching on no-K.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Cheers,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Thorsten</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="mso-fareast-language:EN-US"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">From: </span></b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Jason -Zhong Sheng- Hu <fdhzs2010@hotmail.com><br>
<b>Date: </b>Saturday, 15 August 2020 at 15:10<br>
<b>To: </b>Thorsten Altenkirch <psztxa@exmail.nottingham.ac.uk>, "agda@lists.chalmers.se" <agda@lists.chalmers.se><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: Weird termination problem</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="background:white"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">I once saw someone else's code where termination checker also failed with no good reason. the author worked around it by turning on K. could you see if K works around it
for you?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Thanks,</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Jason Hu</span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black"><a href="https://hustmphrrr.github.io/">https://hustmphrrr.github.io/</a></span></b><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:black">From:</span></b><span style="color:black"> Agda <agda-bounces@lists.chalmers.se> on behalf of Thorsten Altenkirch <Thorsten.Altenkirch@nottingham.ac.uk><br>
<b>Sent:</b> August 15, 2020 9:25 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> agda@lists.chalmers.se <agda@lists.chalmers.se><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Agda] Weird termination problem</span> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Hi,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">I just transferred some code form my lecture notes to my book draft and now the termination checker complains where there was no problem before:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">thm : {P : Form} → ([] </span>
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif">⊢</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> P)
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif">⇔</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt">
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif">⊢</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt">sk P</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">proj₁ thm d = skC→sk (</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif">⊢</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt">→</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif">⊢</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt">skC
d)</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">proj₂ thm SS = S-d</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">proj₂ thm KK = K-d</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="DE" style="font-size:11.0pt">proj₂ thm (app d e) = app (proj₂ thm d) (proj₂ thm e)</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span lang="DE" style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">so here </span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif">⊢</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt">sk P is inductively defined and there should be no problem – and indeed there wasn’t before.
But now</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Termination checking failed for the following functions:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> thm</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Problematic calls:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> proj₂ thm e</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">I can’t make any sense out of it. Has anybody an inkling what could have happened or any advice what I could do to fix it.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">I can prove the <= direction on its own with no problems. The definition of
</span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Cambria Math",serif">⇔ is exactly the same as before and it doesn’t help if I expand it. Also the definition of products is the same as before.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">If you want to have a look at the code please let me know – I will give you access to the repo.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Cheers,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Thorsten</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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